"Most of the men I know including myself are usually attracted to women
sexually because of the woman’s looks. I understand that when the relationship
gets serious it needs more than looks to sustain it for either gender.
My question is, are women also attracted to looks first? Most of the
girls I have talked to about this subject I think have been less than honest
with me. I too often see the good looking guy get more attention at a party than
the George Costansa look a like.
Your thoughts????"
My immediate thought was, yes, of course. We women talk about who's "hot" and not. Heck..I spent about ten minutes with my hair dresser today naming all the men we thought hot in the movie industry. When I was younger that was the first and primary thing. All else stemmed from that "chemistry," and attraction, generally based on looks. This is why I hooked up with my ex. I thought him good looking and just my "type" physically. He backed it up by being hysterically funny, an adventurer, a great kisser and had a great cock (which he used really well). These things cemented the relationship deal for me.
As I am no longer young, I did a scientific poll of a small sampling of young women in various stages of the 20's (these would be my daughters, ages 20, 24 and 28). The youngest said this was her first consideration and priority (and man, she brings home some very good looking young men). When I asked her if her galfriends had similar views, she said "yes, of course...unless she's ugly." The middle one chooses her partners based on bone structure (cheekbones are the measure of the man). Her general reply when someone is nice and likes her, but isn't Orlando Bloomesque is: "Mom..you KNOW how shallow I am." The oldest said it's more complicated than that. I asked her what was the first thing she felt with her husband and she said it was a percentage looks but more important was the feeling and energy she felt..."the chemistry, whatever that means." She thinks looks play a major roll initially for women, but that if you meet a good looking guy and he's an "asshole or idiot" then it's a complete turn-off.
I will make a blanket statement and invite other women to comment on it, as I don't know if it's the case or not. I get the sense, and it's also been my experience, that if we meet someone in person first, then looks and energy are the initial attractions. Physical appearance, the way he holds himself, his confidence, the way he looks at us, eye contact, the way he's groomed and dressed, his smile, not only the way his eyes look physically but what they exude energetically...all play a vital role. Initially. I think most women would agree with my eldest daughter in the idiot department.
With the invention of the internet, however, I think that it gets even more complicated. All the considerations mentioned above play an important part, but....the connections, if made online first, can override some of that stuff. Yes, there are many times where people feel a great connection online or over the phone, then it fizzles the minute they meet because the looks aren't what fits. Or the energy. A good friend was recently excited about meeting someone she had a phone/email thing with. Then the minute she met the guy, she felt no "chemistry."
And I will admit to not understanding "chemistry" and all that, except outside of woowoo considerations. I've had numerous experiences where I felt no chemistry at first, but it grew with time. I've also shared a number of times on here, and will again, that if I had met my Loverman in person first, I doubt I would be with him. I had even seen a picture of him, but when I met him, I was startled. Not attracted. At all. But I felt the connection from our internet adventures and it didn't matter. We sat and talked on a couch. When he reached up and put his hand on my neck, I melted, closed my eyes and kinda went into a trance. The first time he came up inside me, it felt like "home." I've also had numerous times when I meet someone and don't find them attractive, but then the more I get to know them, the more attractive they become to me. Really. I have this with Loverman. I don't find him physically unattractive any more.
I'm interested in others' thoughts. Ladies? Or men who've talked to women about this?
31 comments:
We could write essays here i am sure..
But yes the chemistry thing - given the chance to evolve can be hypnotic but there is something else to it as well..
I have a male friend that I date from time to time He is very (VERY) attractive and interesting and lovely company. We see each other every couple of weeks and have done for the last two years.. There is no chemistry - none. I have never had such chaste kisses goodnight. Nothing else..
Then there is my recent lover. We had nothing but chemistry. I wasn't overly attracted to his physical self yet I was like Pavlovs Dog with him - as soon as I saw his name come up on my phone or in my email box I couldn't help but think when I would next have his skin next to mine. Pure sex. Nothing else..
Then there is the last man.. the man I am (about to be) with. We met via the internet - we talked a lot and then we met. Before we met there was mild chemistry on my behalf - a curiousity as to why we would be meeting like this and what substance it would have.. We met. I didn't give anything, chemistry, attraction anything a chance.. I kissed him really without taking him all in at first. That was the first contact. He saw me and walked up to me and I turned around and kissed him and it felt like I knew him already.
There has been some rocky patches and I am still evaluating the áttraction' thing.. But it kind of works.
But looks without chemistry is not enough.. Chemistry without a genuine connection is not enough.. Something completely off the wall is sometimes enough.. I don't know. It changes.. it's unpredicable.
Well, let me see. All of the men I've either married or had children with are approximately 5' 10" with dark hair. Similar looks too, kinda.
Of course I'm attracted to looks, a lot,and body type for sure but chemistry overrides looks.
A good looking man does not have to be and idiot or an asshole for me to not be attracted either. I might see him from afar and be interested but once I meet him, if the chemistry isn't there the looks don't matter in the least. He can be a nice guy and if there is no energetic match then looks just do anything for me.
Once I had an affair with a man who initially I thought was very freaky looking and I was very unattracted to him. Then I met him and after talking with him for awhile I found what a wonderful person he was and he looked much better right away and I ended up having sex with him. Later, after I had known him for awhile I thought he was nice looking and I would often stare at him and try to figure out why I thought he was so hideous looking when I first met him. I could not figure it out.
Fascinating post. When I was younger I was all over the place when it came to attraction. Certainly I was motivated to an extent by looks, whether it was: "He's cute, I want him", or "He fits my criteria". I couldn't point to a specific type, but certainly at my most prolific period in terms of lovers, they were almost all within "the tribe": tattoos, piercings, a similar lifestyle to mine.
By the time I met my daughter's father, I was driven by biological imperatives - I chose him over another man, who would certainly have been a better bet in terms of a partner because apparently my genetic makeup sensed someone who would give me a child who cancelled out my perceived bad points (which he did: I have a tall, beautiful, olive-skinned, curly-haired child).
Now my criteria differ. I need someone who will stimulate me sexually and intellectually, and looks and physical type seem almost irrelevant. What I notice, though, is that even with those people I meet first in the flesh, the relationship must be played out to some extent on-line. I find that I reveal myself more when I write, and I am more able to read someone through their writing - email, chat, whatever - than I often am in a more social setting. There is less to distract, and less inhibition.
Gillette thank you for responding to my comment so elegantly. I can certainly relate to the part where you feel that confidence in a man plays a role.
My mother tried for years to groom me to be a model. (She has this need to live vicariously through me) So she spent thousands of dollars on braces and fixing my teeth. The confidence I gained through a perfect smile has been huge.
As for the rest of your post it is pretty much my own viewpoint.
You're right; the Internet turns the conventional order of relationship development upside down. Through blogging you get to know someone intellectually first. How else can you evaluate someone whom you know only through what they write here? The good thing about that is looks don't get in the way of making a connection. The dangerous thing is that, if you follow up by meeting on the phone or in real life, there is a risk the person's real-life attributes won't measure up to the fantasies you've developed in your mind.
That didn't happen with you and Loverman, which is good, but I imagine others have been disappointed when they met in real time.
Cherrie (who's gone this morning) and I both agree that respect, kindness, consideration and intellect can make someone attractive and sexy whether or not he or she conforms to society's conventions about what makes a person physically attractive.
22 years old and I've dated the nerd, the uber hott high school senior when I was just a soph. ;) (my greatest accomplishment), the druggie badass, the really nice genuine guy, the dread head musician, the farmer, the frat boy, the motorcycle man, the cool kid, the heir, the skater, and had the typical crushes on coaches and teachers. Of course I am going to check out and stare down the hott and handsome men first, be it young or old. But CONFIDENCE and personality take over quickly, and if I'm not entertained...Buh-bye. I agree that there are some advantages to the internet, allowing ourselves to get to know the person before the body, but, there is that possibility of the chemistry fading the moment you meet. That's quite a let down. As we age, do our various attractions to men change? I've filtered through a lot of different men, and I think I've got my dream man pegged: me, just with no anxiety. But, I'm not looking for him at the moment really. I think I like the courtesan idea because I still get to explore all different types of men, although, not really looking forward to funky bodies (which is the pro for meeting men naturally...going back to the physical attraction thing).
So, that's my speech: Attraction first, but personality and comfort win in the end.
Great topic, Gillette (thank you Toy)!
My thoughts. . . We all, men and women, are visual critters to some extent.
I think the theory that this changes over time is right on.
From the beginning until about 25 - - The visual stimulation by someone I found "hot" in my younger years brought nothing but trouble! Looking back, I have a theory that those "hot" boys brought nothing but trouble because they knew they were "hot". I was what I believe it totally typical for many young females. . . a "bad boy" chaser. If he had the "bad boy" look that gave him the "wow factor" which was sure to turn heads with friends, co-workers and people in general. Part of me is ashamed to admit that I may have passed over a select few VERY good (soon-to-be-)men because they were not "hot" and did not have that "wow" factor.
From 25 until about 28 - - The need for a "hot" boy began to fade and I gave up on the idea that I could find a good man who to whom I was also attracted. I was open to anyone who would take me.
From 28 until about 29 - - The end of my acceptance of anyone who would love me regardless of that visual attraction came when I decided that I deserved to be initially visually attracted to someone. I did not have to "force" myself to grow to be attracted to someone. But, at the same time, I also deserved someone wonderful who would treat me as I treated them. I guess this stage was more of an openness to an attraction to someone who was not what I would consider unattractive.
From Kahuna until today - - Then, of course, I met Kahuna. (pause and smile internally and esxternally) There was an instant physical/visual attraction. But, the attraction to him from the beginning was so much more. . . I was so attracted to him on so many more levels and for so many more reason, his physical beauty was not the first thing that would come to mind, even when I first met him.
I think the theory that the internet opens a whole new slant to this discussion is also true to some extent. I think it is quite possible to become very attracted to someone you speak to on-line before ever securing a visual attraction to them. That can be a beautiful thing. . . finding a common ground and looking beyond looks. However, this can be a bit dangerous as you can see this person as visually attractive in your mind, making them out to be a certain way. The danger enters the scene if you meet and there is a total UNattraction visually. We are only human. Though most of us would not like to admit it, I think many of us are capable of allowing that on-line attraction to be extinguished due to a total lack of visual attraction.
These are just my thoughts, as honest as I can put them. I hope I have not offended anyone. I appreciate the fact that I can speak openly and honestly while being respected as having my own opinion.
Good Saturday evening Gillette,
I am very visual in terms of being physically attrcated to someone.
If I'm just seeing him as I drive by, I may only think about sex for a second, or "he's hot !"
If it is in person, it's all about chemistry, than intangible connection that draws me to someone who I think is cute and then I want to talk to him, be around his energy initially and see what else is there as a person.
No matter how technically good looking someone else thinks aguy is, if I'm not into him, he isn't visually-emoitonally attractive to me.
So Brad Pitt for instance, doesn't cut it.
But Sam Elliot would drive me crazy. (Remember him in 'Lifeguard', and in 'Mask' with Cher ?)
I love looking at a guy I'm in love with. All of him intrigues me, and I totoally fantasize about him naked when I see him in clothes.
Just my 2 cents.
Thank you for coming by my Blog and commenting recently, b.t.w. - I appreciate it !
And I started a new erotica blog, if you want to check it out ! I'd love to know what you think !
It is called 'Mhmmm Yes I Love That' at
http://www.yesilovethat.blogspot.com
Happy Reading, and I'll be back to visit you and read more of your posts as well !
Sincerely,
Loving Annie
p.s. I really enjoy Cherrie & Hardin's blogs too !
when I was young looks were the first consideration, I didn't know there was anything else to consider. Then I grew up a little, met the love of my life, I didn't find him physicaly attractive to look at although he had a kind of boyish charm for an older man (35 then). He tore my heart apart durng the next 2 years. By the time I met my ex I just accepted him, there was no attraction, no real chemistry even just someone who accepted me.
In the past year I have discovered that looks are not everything. I think without exception those men who I have become most attached to have not been the most attractive visually.
All of them I have met online, taking time to get to know each other. I totally agree that the chemistry online does not always carry through when we meet face to face.
For me even when meeting and finding we have chemistry it still isnt quite enough until we kiss, that first kiss tells me whether it will work. if his kisses dont have me melting in his arms then its goodbye.
Currently I have a passionate hunger for a certain man. we met online, chatted, became friends, he showed me a picture,I didnt fancy him. I like to think I keep an open mind,try not to judge a book by its cover all that sort of thing. So I didn't dimiss him but was in no hurry to meet him. He made it clear he wanted to meet but was not pushy. He became my confidante, I told him about all the men I met, we discussed my feelings about them. Then a few months go we met. I found him to be much more attractive than I had exected, But I still didn't fancy him. We chatted for a couple of hours. By the time we kissed goodbye I knew I liked him. We met again the next day for an hour. Lots of talking and kissing. By the end of this hour I felt that I couldn't let him go. He had become the sexiest man ever in my eyes.
Looks are impotant but not more so than chemistry, but for me the kissing and the physical connection are more important, as for interlect, if it didn't exist I wouldn't have met them in the first place.
crumbs - I came back thinking surely Gillette would have edited my comment it was too long.. and I see everyone else has had an amazing amount to input into this discussion.. way cool..
ALso wanted to say something about looking for 'good breeding legs' in a potential partner.. (like Z said - the biological thing)
Fusion has shorter legs than me I am sure - blows that criteria outta the water..
Oh boy.
Since I am, at best, average looking, I had to deal with the 'women are looking for cute guys' from the (lack of) receiving end. Eventually, though, I realized that energy and confidence could overcome crooked teeth and premature balding.
However, I do agree that women are visual creatures, because of a different sampling than yours--bisexual women. Women who are into women certainly notice the hotties and the really attractive ones and make comments appropriately.
And you're right--the internet does change a lot of that. I've had both 'wow, she's hotter than I expected' and 'what? she's not at all in person like I sensed over the internet.' Future post, I suspect. I just know that it helped me with both my dating and sex life to connect with someone energetically earlier than one often does face to face.
Thank you all for stopping by and adding to the conversation. Can't spend too much time at the computer to respond right now, but did want to say hey...just listening at the party.
Hugs.
Happy Sunday to you, Gillette, and hope you and Albert have an excellent time in Las Vegas this week ! Looking forward to reading all about it when you get back !
I can think of only one man that I was so attracted to that it didn't even matter what he looked like. It was chemical, I'd get near his body and start to cream and imagine myself fucking him silly. We never touched, not once, (I was his supervisor where I worked). I'd have to go into the ladies room and sit down to control my body which wanted to fuck him so bad it was weird.
Otherwise, I have no type, I've had all sorts of men, starting with mind connection leading to sexual, starting with sexual leading to "love". The only thing they all had in common was that they were attracted to me. I like men who like me. That's the common thread.
Some men who look good, just are uninteresting, and some men, who are not the standard magazine attractive are so sexy because of their spirits or souls or personality. But by far, if he don't like me, it don't work.
Love always makes people beautiful to me, no matter what the shell starts out looking like, once I love them, they become beautiful.
In the swinger world, there are soooo many couples where the woman is attractive and the guy is a FUCKING TROLL!!
Looks may be important to women, but not AS important as they are to men.
I keep wondering from my post and all that's been written here about what exactly "chemistry" is. I keep hearing people say it's either there or not and they know right away whether it is or not.
Anyway...
My back's been whacked. Since I leave tomorrow for LV, I've been babying it. Hopefully it will be well tomorrow and I'll take lots of Advil to be able to talk right, get a Breema before leaving so hopefully will be able to move my hips...(ahem...cough, cough.)
Thanks again, all for commenting and adding to. And welcome Rowan!!! So happy you commented! Please do so whenever your sweet heart desires.
Can a man add to this debate?
I've always been wary of this "men are visual" observation. I've always been more turned on by words than pictures, still or moving. Most modern visual porn bores me rigid, but fortunately blogs and Literotica are there, ready and waiting. It's a bit like preferring radio drama (which, thanks to BBC Radio 4, we get a lot of here) over TV - the pictures are nearly always better.
As for sexual attraction, well, I've never really considered myself good looking, and always felt myself at a disadvantage. However, since disporting myself on the net, I have discovered that I can attract partners, through words, and even maintain that attraction face to face (and, er, other bits). And it works both ways. I currently have a lover (I think I'm allowed to call her that) who I probably wouldn't have looked at twice in "real life", or her me, we are both so far outside each others normal parameters. And yet, we bonded purely through each others words, then met, and just seemed to flow together, physically.
There's something truly mysterious in all this. It's maybe best to keep it that way.
Okay you freak me out. I have lumbago since Saturday night. The nurse was attractive in that she had clear skin good eyes and mouth, but if she got naked it wouldn't have interested me. The Chemistry thing, I think it's musk or perfume coming off the body. I have women interested in me and I can't explain why and others I wanted to be interested in me and they weren't. My girlfriend says the moment she saw me she knew I was the one. ... I always said my permanent relationship would be long legs great tits and a face to die for. I have only ever had the face in my long term relationships... weird... I think it probably depends on barometric pressure, room temperature, body odour, level of horniness, what you have in your mind when your eyes meet, and the amount of electrical charge you are carrying in your finger tips...oh and self honesty....
Looks initially, for about 5 minutes until the first words come out of his mouth. If the guy I see I am not attracted to initially, but his personality is off the charts, then, as Adrienne said, he starts to "change looks-wise" before my eyes and I don't even realize it.
I will say I like dark hair, squinty eyes and nice teeth.
Cindy
gillette, long-time reader, first-time commentator. terrific writing, and i've added you to my list of links.
like z, for me, it's all about "someone who will stimulate me sexually and intellectually." looks do matter, but in a very animal sort of way...just in the same way that scent matters. the way a man smells is a big factor for me in whether or not i'm attracted to him, often in a way i'm not even intially conscious of. w/ my guy now, though, i knew immediately, he had me w/ his smell.
whoa, I worte a big long comment on this post, and it disappeared *frown* I've heard of that happening but never to me before, oh well...
I was basically agreeing with what Hardin said about the internet changing how some relationships start now.
And now i have to agree with the man with secrets as well, he said partially what i was saying, that my current lover and I would not have had that special first kiss had we not gotten to know each other first over the internet and from reading each others blogs...
This is fun...lots of first time commenters- THANKS!!!!!
Continuing to listen...and thanks Tara, I'll add you to mine!!
There's some strong emerging science to this attraction biz too. Helen Fisher for one does a nice run down of this in several books. But suffice it to say that humans are enormously visual animals. That's where the attraction normally begins. But within that there are scads of personal preferences. Some like them stout & muscular, some lean & hungry. Some like certain facial features, and some like certain padding along certain lines of the anatomy.
Almost all agree that the most important parameters are in the face for a judgment of 'beauty' and then secondarily on 'shape' for a quick assessment of health, welfare or even 'kindness' (eyes etc). (OK that was back on the face again, but you get the idea).
I think this also changes a bit with age & experience. And hopefully the accumulation of self knowledge that might be termed 'wisdom'. Sometimes that may come very late, or in more unfortunate circumstances not at all. So what you 'go for' at 25 probably is not exactly what you're looking for at 35, and still a bit different than 45 or 55. Needs change, as do wants & desires. A 'big rack' on a comely lass of 25 is quite different for 'grand dame' of 55! A healthy head of hair for a guy is bound to be a bit different again as he ages.
So personality and character probably becomes increasingly important just as the 'mating' aspects of the relationship or age group (post 40's say) fade from view. This is not to neglect the pleasures of the flesh, it's just that you probably are fairly selective when you get to the geezerdom stage. After all, there's only a very few people you'll want to see you naked by then! Cheers, 'VJ'
I have to say that looks are not particularly important to me in terms of a feature of attraction, at this point in my life. Yes, I do remember it being more important when I was young, and I can still look at someone and appreciate the aesthetics... but it doesn't make me want to have sex with them. Even when I "rate" celebrities on how they look, I can't even start to consider those I believe are stupid or obnoxious, no matter what they look like. I like the ones whose looks seem to go with some personality feature that I appreciate. Looks are important now only in terms of liking the looks of someone who is already important to me. I sometimes look at my lovers, and think how much I adore how they look... even though they aren't 'conventionally' attractive, or don't meet the criteria that I once thought important.
Totally agree about the role of the Internet in taking away some of the role of looks in establishing relationships. I've yet to meet someone in person after getting to know them on the Internet and not find them attractive. If we get to the point of wanting to meet, I'm already attracted. Looks are irrelevant at that point.
I think the energy makes the looks.
Greetings,
Vanessa
Fascinating discussion. Thanks for letting me listen in.
When I haven't met someone yet (either in person or in cyberspace), her looks are what attracts my attention, of course. But the older I get, the wider a range of "attractive" I seem to have. But "attractive" can vanish in a flash once I get to know her personality.
I recall awhile back a repeat visit with a ladyfriend whom I hadn't seen in a few months. I was thinking to myself in advance how much I liked her, but that objectively she might be considered somewhat less attractive than average among the ladies I saw. When she opened the door I remember being pleasantly surprised that she was more attractive than I remembered. Maybe because my memory focused on her appearance but in person the "whole package" was there?
Chevalier
Could be, Chevalier. I really have had that happen where I wonder if the person in front of me is attractive or not..I only know I like them and that's enough.
Wow, this post is over a year old, but I found it during a Google search, and have decided I'd like to comment. : D
I am 33 years old... and almost entirely stimulated by a man's physical appearance. I see a lot of women here saying that, as they have gotten older, looks became less important. With me, it's the complete opposite; in my twenties, I wasted 5 years of my life with a complete loser. I heard the "you can do WAY better than that" comments from friends, many times.
Of course, not only was he physically unattractive, but his personality reeked, too. There is this misconception that ugly men are always "nice guys", but I'm here to say NOT TRUE. In most of my experiences, the cute guys were incredibly nice to me, whereas the not-so-hots always seemed bitter, hostile & egotistical.
I know now that I hooked up with my ex for the wrong reason; I pitied him. That horrible relationship taught me something, though; never allow a man to guilt-trip you into an intimate involvement. Today, being much wiser, I get with a guy for the RIGHT reason... because I am legitimately attracted to him.
I care about looks above all else, because I have no interest in a long-term relationship. I've discovered that I'm not the relationship type; I feel smothered in such scenarios. My "me time" is very important to me, and I generally prefer being alone, unless I'm horny. ; )
Anyhow, I'm a very visual female, so the idea that we can't be as motivated by looks as men is a complete falsehood. Also, it is my opinion that women who settle for unattractive men either have low self-esteem, are unattractive themselves, feel obligated to not come off as a "shallow bitch" (despite men having no problem exercising their "shallow bastard" attitude), feel pity for the downtrodden, or are into the sport of gold-digging.
I met my late husband (who was not 'good looking') at work. He was interesting, intelligent, gentle and funny and I fell in love with him by degrees.
This time around is the reverse of that. First time I met M....wham!! Instant chemistry, but not just in the sexual sense. I looked into his eyes and felt this jolt of a connection like we'd known each other in another lifetime. That feeling has never gone away. He says he feels it too. Yes, he is good looking (I'm biased but girlfriends have also said so) but that on its own would never have been enough.
love and hugs xxx
Hey, M:e..fun to find you here in the archives :)
I had that recognition with my ex..that knowing we had been together many times before. And we had. It's an intense feeling, yes?
I'm so glad you found each other.
I know that if I look at a guy and he is attractive, I think about sex. For a relationship though I need more than looks to make it thrive.
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